*WARNING: HEATED TOPIC ALERT (DaVinci)

[D.A.R.K.[CotC]]

All of the gosples were not written by what the title says. Gospel of John, Mark, Judas, or whatever, all of them were written at least 20-40 years after the events transpired, and by Paul (almost all of them were written by him). Judas, Mark and the rest did not write anything down, they just went around the world and preached Jesus' word. Which leads me again to the Council of Nicae (someone correct me if I'm wrong with the spelling).

The Councel of Nicae was brought about by Constantine, the Roman emperor that made Christianity the core religion of Rome. The council was made up of scholared Romans who decided on everything from what the bible should say to what the sacrements were and stood for. The only basis of what they had to go on was tradition, what the "norm" at the time was. This tradition was the only thing they could use to decide what should stay and what should go. It makes sense that they had to do this because if you put all the books together, nothing makes sense because they contradict each other.

One book lables Judas as the most evil villain ever, another lables him as the hero that saved mankind (because if not for him, Jesus would not have died for our sins and we would not have been saved). One book says Peter was Jesus' favorite, one says Mary was, one says someone else was. The books also contradicted on who was left to lead the church, how Jesus was raised from the dead (some books say he wasn't). It's a long list of one idea vs. another...

So in all this confusion, something I suppose had to come out that seemed "orderly" and right, which we have today as our modern bible. But then why were so many different books with opposing views created? Especially when the majority of them were written by the same person...

[Dataspel]

Dark said:


So in all this confusion, something I suppose had to come out that seemed "orderly" and right, which we have today as our modern bible. But then why were so many different books with opposing views created? Especially when the majority of them were written by the same person...

If the Nicene creed is a sticking point, then let's start earlier. In the
days of the young Church, there was literally no new testament and
no canon, since it was not written yet. You had your Ebionites (Jews
who believed that Jesus was a merely a holy man touched by God),
and your Marcionites (Christians who believed that the old testament
God was evil, and the new testament God was good, and that Jesus
was not really a man), your Gnostics (Jesus taught a type of knowledge
that, once understood, would free the person from the world), and of
course your Romans (Jesus is both God and man, and that the Godhead
is a Trinity).

Or let's start even earlier. What does Jesus Himself say?
1. Jesus is a feminist. Don't even argue this one, it is transparent
in all 4 gospels. Jesus accepted the support of women and treated
them as equals. This is not to say the least considered a
characteristic of the Mediterranean mindset. Q.E.D.
2. Jesus is an eschatological prophet. That is, he preaches and
teaches the end of the world. He is, after all, the disciple of John
the Baptist, and especially Matthew emphasizes this. Whether he
means the literal end of the world, or whether he is merely
expressing himself in the context of his school is left as an
exercise for the reader
3. Jesus transcends his time. I am only going to present one
argument: The Roman milieu at 0 BC was characterized by an
ovewhelming sense of nihilism. Kind of like today . People no
longer had faith in the pagan gods and needed something real.
The real thing was of course Judaism, which understood that
there was only one alligiance and one God. But Judaism carried
baggage (circumcism, etc) and a new way was needed. That
new way was Christianity, a translation of Judaism, which became
the religion of women, children and slaves. True then, and even
more true now.
4. Jesus' mission was cut short. He did not have time to appoint
a successor. It is reasonable to argue that no succeesor could
possibly be selected.

So where does that leave us? IMHO, 2000 years ago someone
set off a tsunami in the human heart and soul. We are still
experiencing the aftershocks, so go with the flow, grasshopper

[BD]

The sensationalist aspect of The Da Vinci Code is that Jesus
got married and had children. Well, so what? Was Peter married?
Yes, because there is a reference to the house of his mother-in-law,
but his wife and possible family is otherwise not mentioned at
all. The same could easily be true of Jesus.

Data, you seem pretty knowlegable... is there someplace in the Bible that says/indicates that Jesus will judge us based on some authority or reason? (I ask because I don't know if my next statement is based on LDS or Bible teachings)

[Dataspel]

I don't know - my interest is in historical Jesus studies, and I am
not up on theology. But I googled it and there is at least one
reference in John 5:
And he [God] has given him [Jesus] authority to judge because
he is the Son of Man.

[SLIDER]

BD & Data the Bible does state this in regards to your posts:

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?bo ... text=verse


Here is another with the Father = God giving Judgement unto the Son = Jesus

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?bo ... text=verse

there will be 2 judgements:

the Great White Throne in Revalations which is for the unbelievers:

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?bo ... xt=context

& then there is the Judgement Seat of Christ which is for the believers:

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?se ... &version=9

Hope this helps

[BD]

Well I can't find it so I need to go back to the source. In the mean time, here's a canadian website for you all to dissect: http://www.british-israel.ca/

[Aide-de-Camp]

Data has his data down.

Dan Brown's fictional work is based upon a genetic bloodline exclusively attributed to two documents from the French National Archives...whatever those are called.

Upon research for yourself you'll find these documents are not based in fact and were retracted by the author who submitted them to the archives.

It does make for nice fiction and it has not hurt my faith. But for those who have never heard the gospel and believe what they witness in this film I fear the fiction for them may be more foundational and of greater consequence for their faith.

I wonder in retrospect how Salmon Rushdie might feel in the face of Dan Brown's success...

[Ender[CotC]]

So basicaly, this whole controversy is over whether Jesus had a wife (and kids) or not, right?

I think it's funny there is so much strife about this book. After all, it is fiction. It is a novel. It's only based on real information.

I think is a cool story.

[Ender[CotC]]

oh.... i like the ninja turtles too.

I was really into them as a kid, and even dressed up as one for halloween.

I believe that is wher our generation (and others) got our emence love for pizza.

[Buzzed]

Isn’t it ironic……
We are in the midst of a censorship battle in another forum for this very topic..

Ninja's were great! I loved the Pizza

[D.A.R.K.[CotC]]

Ah Buzzed but as you can see we have not cast any stones at each other here, we are expressing our views in a more civilized manner. I wonder if those warnings I put into the beginning did anything....

[TooLBlue]

It sounds like you miss the stone throwing.

[D.A.R.K.[CotC]]

Don't insinuate it Tool... and no I don't miss it b/c I'm the kind of person that does whatever is possible to be on everybody's good side

[Dataspel]

It may have had something to do with the headline, but I can't
really recall any controversies that started with posts concerning
religion. Mostly it is politics and internal clan issues that start
the really nasty fights that lead to disrespect, people quitting, etc.

[BD]

lol data... all you played this week is less than an hour of minesweeper...